Lost npcs?

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Neko
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Lost npcs?

Postby Neko » Wed Aug 27, 2014 8:41 am

Hi,
I was looking in my BoD folder, and when I opened the "Icons" folder I realized that I have never seen the Demon or Bug, neither in the original game nor in a mod (I think), although I have been seeing these icons in that folder since I was a kid.
Image Image
Now I want to see those npcs, if they actually are in the gamedata. Can someone find a pic of them for me, or give me some info? I haven't found one yet.

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Thordrek
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Re: Lost npcs?

Postby Thordrek » Wed Aug 27, 2014 8:56 am

Hi Neko,

I always saw these creatures too, but I never find it inside the game. I checked all the meshes in the game and seems this too don´t appear.
The first one, the "demon", it looks for me like some kind of troll, like a troll of fire or something like that.
The second one, the "bug", looks totally new, but seems that the picture is the only inside the game.
Maybe I´m wrong, but until I saw, these pictures is the only you can find of these enemies :(
Under the Mountain dark and tall
The King has come unto his hall!

Neko
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Location: Spain

Re: Lost npcs?

Postby Neko » Wed Aug 27, 2014 10:26 am

Oh, what a pity! That demon looks scary.
Thank you for the info, Thordrek :D

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prospero
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Re: Lost npcs?

Postby prospero » Wed Aug 27, 2014 10:39 am

There are lots of loose ends in the game. The only complete working missing monster is the Salamander. It's resurrected in the Gladiator mod, but was dropped from the game for whatever reason best known to the developers. If you are interested, you can find where it was to appear (only once) in the Dark Tower level. In the room where you have to climb up the pedestals to reach the exit. If you watch the Sally, the movements are quite jerky so maybe they weren't quite satisfied with it.

There are Dark and Gold ork models which are not used. They are exactly the same mesh, just different textures. If you apply the meshes to the standard ork, they work fine. But create a Dark Ork as a separate race and he has a limp. :?

There are lots of weapons not used and some which are still in the game but have no apparent use. The Amazon character appears to have gone though a few revisions. She seems to have been intended to wield a lot of martial arts type weapons. There are also unused amz animations for using a weapon in each hand. One bit of BOD trivia. The Double Sword is designated as an Amazon weapon. If you are playing Zoe and pick one up, the 'Press F1' banner will pop up.

There are .wav files for a crossbow sound. The bow model is absent but I think the bolts are there.

The story goes that BOD was rather rushed to completion to meet release dates. That's why the online play feature is a bit crap.

Neko
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Re: Lost npcs?

Postby Neko » Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:02 pm

Thanks Prospero, and yeah the Salamanders are a bit dumb, each time you hit them they trip and they stand up again.

If I remember correctly, there are some Dark Orks in the Tower level too, at the beginning. I'm not really sure though, I played the original story years ago.

About the weapons, there are some short daggers that are very cool, from the original game I think. The duel with a tiny dagger in Ascension was just priceless.

One last thing that I just remembered and intrigues me a lot, Prospero, did you do a playable Vamp character? I read something about it some months ago when I was looking for another thing. If you still have it on hand, I would like to try it out because I tried to do it by myself reading the small "tutorial" that you posted in that topic, but I suck hard and I couldn't do it :roll:

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prospero
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Re: Lost npcs?

Postby prospero » Wed Aug 27, 2014 9:00 pm

I think I did do a playable vamp once. Rather embarrassed that I can't remember. :oops: It was probably a couple of PCs ago so the code is maybe lurking on a CD somewhere.....

It's not difficult to make playable NPCs. But far easier to clone the model and build a new race from scratch than try and tack bits onto the existing code.
The things to remember are that NPCs are missing a lot of actions that the proper players already have. NPC don't need to open doors or pick things up, so you need to add these movements to their animation sets by raiding the anims of others. Otherwise you get crashes. Also, some are missing back anchors so that they can't sheathe weapons properly. Although now that the model meshes are available it's not a huge task to add them.

I have a playable Chaos Knight which I have been fooling with. It's like driving a tank. I added a bit more functionality to his attacks. His hunter-seeker missiles can be selected with different damages and he does multiple ball attacks. Also a flamethrower that emanates from the big face on the front of his armour. But he has to keep looking for fuel cans to drink to top this feature up.

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Thordrek
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Re: Lost npcs?

Postby Thordrek » Thu Aug 28, 2014 4:54 am

It sounds so cool! :D :D I want to play as the chaos warrior, must be so funny to crush the little orcs, but maybe too easy to play the game with so big character.

Seems the main problem still to create the new races into the game.

I don´t know very much about code, but I wanted to ask you: if you copy all the lines of, for example, the common orc, and duplicate it for the dark orc just changing the texture, is not enough to have two races, even if they two have totally the same behaviour? Won´t be like a duplicate race just changing the skin?
Sorry if my question is stupid, I just want to know how difficult is to create new races if we work from the original models and animations

Thank you :)
Under the Mountain dark and tall
The King has come unto his hall!

Neko
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Location: Spain

Re: Lost npcs?

Postby Neko » Thu Aug 28, 2014 8:28 am

Oh, thanks anyways Prospero! And the Chaos Knight idea sounds really cool as Thordrek said. :)

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prospero
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Re: Lost npcs?

Postby prospero » Thu Aug 28, 2014 11:15 am

You can switch meshes with code. Between models with matching node numbers anyway. You can put a dark ork mesh on a grey ork.

ork=Bladex.GetEntity("WhateverOrkName")
ork.SetMesh("Dark_Ork")

As you say, the effect is purely cosmetic. He will behave just as a normal ork. You do have to know the exact internal name of the model. You can find this by opening the .BOD file with a hex editor an the name is at the top in human-readable type.

making a new race is complex and needs to be initialised on the map load. I use a well-tried method for this. Quite long to explain, but check out the Wizard map and you'll see a folder NUFiles that contains subfolders ending in .........Stuff. All the files for a new race are in there.

I'll upload the Chaos Knight map later and that might make the process clearer. It's a bit rough but it works. There are also two more new races in it. One is a War Troll (NPC) that uses various anims from others. There is also some archers that are designed to be archers only. You have to put them in inaccessible positions as they cannot move off the spot where you put them. Makes them easier to place dynamically.

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Thordrek
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Re: Lost npcs?

Postby Thordrek » Fri Aug 29, 2014 5:54 am

Great!!

I will be waiting the upload, but at home by the moment I still without internet, so I will take a time to can download it.

I understand what you said about switch meshes with code, but I wanted to ask you:

For example, I want to put in a same level a dark ork and a grey ork, that they two live together in the same enviroment. It is possible to duplicate the code lines of the ork to have the two different orks living together?
I hope so, because even if it´s just cosmetic, I think it enriches the world, like there are different kind of dwarves or different kind of knights.

I will try again the Wizard map to say you exactly what bug I have, maybe I´m doing something wrong, but in the weekend I hope I have enough time to test a lot of things.
I will start to learn LED too, I really want to start to can do my own levels.

Thank you! :) :)
Under the Mountain dark and tall
The King has come unto his hall!


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